Should We Become Parents

From BluWiki

Welcome to our little experiment in the wisdom of crowds. We're kicking around the idea of becoming parents, and thus assembled for ourselves a list of pros and cons. We thought we'd post this list on the web, and encourage people to annotate it. Regular readers of my website may recall this topic being first introduced a while back.

Note that this isn't a list about the pros and cons of procreating--it's about becoming parents. We're open to both adopting and the old fashioned way.

To contribute, just edit this document by adding new list items, or commenting on existing items by adding bullet points under the pertinent item. If you want to identify yourself, add a link in parentheses after your comment or list item. We wrote the first 15 items on each list.

IMPORTANT: Please don't delete any list items. We'd like this to become a generalized list. If a bunch of people comment negatively on a specific item, then that item is as good as deleted, anyway.

These are not in any particular order. If you have any other 'meta' conversation to add, you can do so at the associated blog post on my site.

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Pros

Could be fun
Could make us less selfish
- or more; people often put children first
- I don't think it makes you less selfish, but you are less able to indulge your selfishness.
Raising children could be interesting
Another new project, like running a business or building a house
- in theory, but not practice, you can fire a lousy contractor or employee for not keeping your schedule, kids have their own agenda.
We have property on an island, which seems kid-friendly
- Of course, the property has a big cliff, but we'd build a fence. (DB)
- Get a deck railing too. Don't be like Mike! / AC
Builds another deep, lifelong relationship in our lives
- that's best case; may be a bad relationship, or no relationship, in the long run
Having children may offer a more complete human experience
- At least, most other humans have it, so there's a certain commonality there. (DB)
Learn new things
- Don't need children to do that.
- Having children will teach you things you cannot learn any other way.
- Some of those things you might not need to learn. *But learning how to remove a pea from someones nose might be the best thing you never needed to learn before you had kids* (VC)
Improve our ability to play
- There is no pleasure like getting to pretend you're a child again while playing with your own child. (Seconded!)
We figure we've got fairly solid genes
Someone to take care of us when we're old
- Bawaa haaa haa hahhaa. Oh wait, you're serious? No, this isn't likely.
- Depends on how well you do the job.
- Children learn by example - take good care of your elderly parents, and your kids are more likely to take good care of you. Be good to you children, they will choose your nursing home.
Would force us to spend less time on the computer
- happened the other way for me, parenting = mommy blogging! (cafemama)
- same for me, though I don't blog. I use WebMD and other children information sites a ton!
We could give birth to a genius
- Yeah, that's likely. (DB)
- Or, you could give birth to the next Hitler... (Ghostlove)
Would make our parents happy
- Only if they can see their precious grandbabies EVERY DAY. Which is too much parent time....
- It's awesome to see your parents' faces light up everytime they see their grandchild. At least when they're young... :-) Regarding the above comment, my grandparents only get to see their grandchild every few months, but weekly video calls make up for it. We use MSN with two cheap webcams.
We wouldn't regret not having kids
- Though you might regret having kids!! :-)
Most kids turn into decent people, and there's a great reward in being part of that.
- You got statistics on that?
- Watching them develop is fascinating, but I reserve feeling 'rewarded' for things I'm certain I caused directly. We feel rewarded by any time we're not breaking who they already are, instead. ;)
You grow up when you become a parent.
- Sometimes too fast
- Or you don't grow up, and screw everything up.
- Sometimes you grow up very painfully, or later than your kids need.
Can't win the dna game if you don't play
- what does this even mean?
- how many kids are you planning to have?!
- Yeah is this a Vancouver/Canada/North America/World domination thing? (Johnny K)
- Very strange comment.
- I think if someone looks at having a family as "the dna game," they really shouldn't be having kids.
Kids seem real cute when they look like you
- Kids also seem cute when they act like you (no matter who they look like).
- But sometimes they are very, very not cute. Sometimes they are evil! ;)
Fun photography options nearly endless (cafemama)
- but can be VERY expensive
Good source of organs / blood
- Haha great point! Remember Homer squeezing Bart's lower back. (Johnny K)
A child is a living legacy; you can put your knowledge and experience into a biovessel and send it out to the future
Your last name and lineage would be better preserved
- only if you have a boy to carry on the name, or a girl who won't give it up!
Your perspective on a lot of things will change
- And you may learn how to express what your beliefs are more clearly in order to pass them on.
- You learn to be a better person and to slow down and enjoy the small things.
There is nothing better to cure a bad day than the warmth of your kids
- unfortunately it is often these days that your kids pick up on your mood and decide its time to play the 'button pushing' game, but upon later reflection they always make you smile.
- Sometimes kids CAUSE the bad days.
- Sometimes they pick up on your mood and make a conscious effort to make you feel better, because they remember that you always try to make them feel better.
You get a to make a difference in a life
- like changing diapers, it makes a huge difference in the smell of your house!
- probably one of the best reasons, in my estimation.
You can make them hate the things you hate.
- Yeah, right. You push too hard, and they'll do/like the things you hate just to get back at you.
- This might qualify as a con as well.
- You can't actually make them do much, in my experience. You can teach them, but how they think is largely up to them in the end. I'd call that a pro!
Nearly the only way to learn the lesson that yes, many things about every person are simply born into them, and you cannot control that. Could be a con too, but I've found that pretty cool.
The unexpected joy and amazement you experience each time they learn to do something new.
- this is the best pro so far. I never knew 'clapping' would be so exciting (Seconded! VC)
- very true
- This is my favourite pro so far. Children, especially small children, develop amazingly quickly so there's not much time to get bored because they're already working towards the next milestone. (Ghostlove)
They remind you how amazing the simplest things can be.
You can take lessons with them and learn things that you didn't get to learn the first time around (like playing the guitar).
It's a great excuse to buy cute, small things.
- Though you could just buy cute, small things for friends/family with kids. (Ghostlove)
- But it's more fun to have the small, cute things for yourself/your own house.
For a few years, you get to play in playgrounds with kids without other adults thinking you're a weirdo.
- Not exactly a pro as you're still not allowed to use the facilities (Johnny K)
- Sez who? I use the monkey bars all the time even though my knees drag along the ground.
- Plus you get to go to the children's museum and the aquarium and the kid's section of the library, where there are always fun things.
An enormous amount of responsibility is a life-changing experience, and most people grow enormously from a sense of responsibility that big.
Strange sense of pride and joy when they accomplish a small task. (Going Potty, Scoring a Goal in Soccer)
Raising children is cheaper than many hobbies.
- Uh, says who? Maybe if you're into racing yachts or flying helicopters. But don't forget: kids get their own hobbies, and you pay for those as well for quite a while.
- By and of themselves, children are not expensive. It's living a yuppy lifestyle with your children that is expensive.
- hello, anyone every heard of diapers, wipes, clothes, besides all their hobbies that come later? A season ski pass would be much less expensive than my daughter.
- A study has shown that it costs $1 million to raise a child from birth to age 18, definitely not cheap.
- Raising kids IS cheap if you're sensible. How do you think so many single mothers (myself included) manage it? (Ghostlove)
You can share your hobbies with your children.
You can develop new hobbies because of and with your children.
Time spent on raising child can result in a social capital contribution, as opposed to many other hobbies and personal pursuits.
- Hey, they made this wiki page... maybe they've done enough.
Raising children is interesting and requires you to research many processes in depth and attempt mastery of many skills.
Children force you to become flexible and seek out new opportunities, since your old ways will no longer work.
Could get stuck with a great kid.
Determining a parenting philosophy requires you to develop negotiation skills and to consider whether you are right, since you must work with your child's other parent, caregivers, teachers, other children and other parents.
Can make a very strong political statement by breastfeeding (or supporting breastfeeding).
- if you can get the damn things to work, trust me most women who don't likely weren't able to. . . it isn't the romantic field of clover with soft mood lighting most think.
- I actually did find it to be a romantic field of clover with soft mood lighting. I have nothing against women who try and can't get it to work. But I do feel a need to make a political statement against people who say it is unnatural, should be covered up, should be replaced with formula, inconvenient, disgusting, etc. I do not mean there is something nasty to be said about those who just can't get it to work.
- Must be from Berkeley. I think I've seen you over in that field of clover at Allston & MLK. Pull down your shirt, your kid is five. Besides, you're making my 2 year old think wistfully of his younger days and it's weirding me out.
- Was definitely a wonderful time in my life. I loved breastfeeding. Also, I nursed my son til he was 21 months old and he's growing up pretty normal and very healthy.
Can make a very strong political statement simply by parenting in a certain way. Your child becomes your political statement, but not in a vacuum.
Can make you realize that making political statements is not among the important things in life. (Derek)
- ...and that politics in general are not all that important either.
Lets you stand out from people who aren't having kids.
You will laugh -- like, crying, bellyaching laugh -- at things they say or do practically every day. Laughing is good for you.
- I love this one, it's 100% true. (Ghostlove)
Other parents provide networking opportunities.
Becoming a parent puts you in contact with other people and you will soon build a clique of like-minded politicos.
- Or you are young and lonely because no one else your age with your ideals is a parent in your small town.
Your worries about many things will seem insignificant, as you realize that your Gucci handbag is really not so important as choosing the right preschool.
You'll start to understand humility, if you're lucky.
Changing your careers to accommodate children forces you to look at productivity, personal worth and career management in new ways.
Pregnancy, post-partum period and breastfeeding force you to realize that your body is capable of things you did not know were possible or so ingrained (not the right word). Let's say you have a better appreciation for what hormones do to you and others.
- and a great deal more respect for your body as a physical organism, with astonishing capabilities.
- and if anything 'goes not as planned' in that process, an opportunity to learn how to forgive your body for not being MORE than the physical organism it is, weaknesses included.
You achieve economies of scale by spreading per capita housing and food costs across several people. E.g. major cost of children is housing, but if you already have a second bedroom or acreage, you have already spent that money anyway.
Sending children to the public school system may allow you a new political lobby outlet.
People (employers, colleagues, strangers) take you more seriously when you're a parent. It may not be fair, but it's true. (Derek)
- But sometimes people think you are less serious about your job when you are a parent.
Parenthood is a chance to take on a truly lifetime challenge and commitment that you cannot, with any decent morals, abrogate. In other words, if you want a Big Hairy Audacious Goal, raising children into decent human beings is right up there. (Derek)
You get to be part of the geeks-with-kids club. (Gmail addresses before birth! iPods at age two! Blogs from kindergarten!). Hmm, maybe this isn't "pro" after all.
You will, very rapidly, understand your own parents so much better.
- not really
- or be even more confounded that they could blow it so badly. (OK, yeah, seconded)
- or be blown away by how they ever managed four when you are struggling with just one.
- This aspect of parenting has been very profound for me. I thought I was having a miscarriage at 10 weeks with my daughter, and I realized how intensely I already loved her... and then I realized that my mother loved me with that same intensity... I was just in awe that anyone could feel that way about flawed, human, often broken Me. And now that my daughter is 14 months old, and I realize how much more I love her than I did when I was 10 weeks pregnant... and then I realize that my mom has had 30 years of me for that love to grow, and grow, and... WOW. I understand that this may not work for people who have bad relationships with their parents, but for me, it has been very unexpected and extremely moving. I feel so much closer with my parents now than I did before I got pregnant.
You'll most likely be less judgmental about how other parents behave with their children in public.
- Or horrified at how awful other parents can be.
Gaining new friends. Parents of your kids' schoolmates, for instance.
- this is one of my big side-bonus items.
You get to take a year off work (theoretically), probably the only time you can do drop out of the work world with societal sanction.
- In the US you only get 6 weeks.
Being proud of your own achievements is one thing, but the pride you feel when your child achieves goals is like that, but cubed. (Lincoln)
Children are especially helpful for declining unwanted social situations ("Oh, I've got to go. Johnny's just climbed on top of the book case again." "Oh I regret that I can't come to your social soir�e, Suzie's got verbal diahria."
You discover the meaning of life.
- Or you discover that "the" meaning isn't as important as "the life" and living it.
- Don't pin all your hopes on this one.
Having children raises your IQ by a few points.
Your child is a personification of your love for each other.
- There's a hint of narcissism here that doesn't bode well.
- Or your child is the reason behind your divorce. 3 a.m. diaper changes aren't romantic.
There is nothing like the first time your child says "I love you" and gives you a big hug and kiss out of the blue on their own.
- I second this heartily! (Me, too!)
Once they are old enough to walk but not talk, they run to the door to greet you after a long hard day at work with a hug full of love to melt your heart!
You will learn a whole new meaning of love that exceeds whatever you currently think it is.
- Including finding new things to love about your spouse.
- Exceeds by orders of magnitude. Astonishing.
- I didn't find this to be true.
You will grow up in ways you simply can't grow up without kids.
- Or a lot of therapy or soul-searching. (Have some childless friends who grew up 'anyway', some who have not.)
You get to play on the playground equipment and go to fun kids events without triggering a call to the police.
Children are beautiful. Really. Especially when they're sleeping. You'll be amazed at how beautiful you think your child is. So, it's like adding an original work of art to the house. An interactive, very messy work of walking art. (Seconded!)
- Big agreement here. Sleeping babies and children are perfection.
- They are the best when they're sleeping! ;)
Travelling with children internationally is a great way to "connect" with the other culture. I've lived in Korea as an expat for ten years now and have never had so many long conversations with strangers as I have since my daughter was born (six month ago!)
Really good reason to get on top of your financial future. Having kids triggers many of the people I know to start thinking about investment, retirement, insurance, will/living will, etc., and taking it seriously.
Good progressive weight training program. High reps, starting at low weight, increasing weight over time.
- Or you never lose the baby weight and then finish off all their leftover food and keep gaining.
You get to embarrass them in front of their friends just like your parents used to do to you. Hours of fun. (Ghostlove)
You might get grandchildren eventually (my mother says the only reason for having kids is so you can have grandchildren). (Ghostlove)
You become a lot more comfortable with your body and lose a lot of inhibitions. Once a load of total strangers have seen you squeeze out a baby, and then the whole world has seen your boobs while you feed the munchkin, you suddenly really don't care if you might be showing a bit too much shoulder. (Ghostlove)
- I have found a much greater acceptance for my very imperfect body as a result of going through pregnancy, labor, and breastfeeding. I may not have the best looking abs or butt on the planet, but only my husband and I could've created this beautiful, smart, hilarious little creature (and really, I did most of the heavy lifting for the first 9 months that she existed. :) ) I'm not sure if I ever would've found this level of self-acceptance otherwise, had I not become a mother.
The rough edges of your pre-child personality may be softened when you realize there is more to life then your own petty problems. You may tend to get over small things quicker then you did before.
You want them to see you as a good person and are inspired to do good things to better society and set a good example for your children.
You will lose control of your life. That's a good thing. It makes you realize that your control was just an illusion before, and it makes you a wiser, less Type-A person. Children by example and by necessity can teach you to approach each moment with existential openness. (Donna B.)

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Cons

If you have to ask, the answer to your question is likely no.
- Not necessarily. After a brief flash of wanting a child, I went back to asking the question, but was pregnant with my son by then. I continued to ask the question all the way up until he came home from the hospital, at which point I realized this was the coolest thing EVER. Asking whether you should be a parent isn't an indication that you shouldn't; it's just an acknowledgement of your completely reasonable apprehension about making an irrevocable decision that will change your life in nearly every way.
Kids are time-consuming
- What else are you going to do, watch Seinfeld reruns?
Kids are expensive
- Very, very expensive
- How so?
- Well, it's a long time before they pay for their own food, clothing, transport, activities, medicine, dentistry and orthodontics, hobbies, glasses, diapers, toys, and travel (to start the list). Plus you need more space to live, maybe a larger and more expensive vehicle, and stuff tends to get broken more often. And then there's saving for education. But you know, great things are worth paying for.
- Doesn't have to be this way. It really depends on the lifestyle you're trying to maintain ... like keeping up with the Joneses. We're working on our fourth and still use public transit to get them around. It may take a bit more planning, but you get used to it and it becomes a PRO - a badge of honor to be raising kids that are conscious of their community around them
- We're in the same 2-bedroom condo as before we have children. Shower gifts provided clothes for nearly 2 years. We still have the same old Civic and we mostly travel on foot. And saving for the RESP is our personal choice. Neither of us got free rides.
- It's only expensive if you put them in full time childcare. Otherwise they don't eat much, they don't care about expensive toys for many years and great clothes can be bought second hand.
Raising children could be boring
- I would describe child rearing as many things, but boring isn't one of them. (denise)
- Sure it is, sometimes. It's everything, at one time or another -- wonderful, blissful, terrifying, dull, infuriating, etc. You'll experience a wider range of emotions. That could be a pro or con. (Derek)
- It's both the most boring and most exciting thing you will ever do.
Kids might take time away from other interesting projects
- Kids will take time away from projects, no "might" about it.
- Kids *become* interesting projects. Besides, who says you can't take them along?
Children limit flexibility & opportunity
- not necessarily, often they can make you see opportunities you never would have before and find new ways of achieving your own goals.
- Well, that's a nice attempt at positive spin, but try going to the movies on a whim when you're a parent. Every outing becomes a military campaign. And you won't do small things any more, because you get an outing so seldom it better be worth it.
  - This stage doesn't last that long, in the great scheme of things. We just went to Europe with a 14 month old. It was a bit of a military campaign, and we could've done several things better, but it was worth it, and we learned a TON.
- Get better neighbors. With our neighbors we have MUCH more flexibility - we swap care on a regular basis. (BTW did any one notice there seems to be a bias towards posting stuff that more frequently pertains to younger children? Once they get past five, life seems to have gotten easier for us.)
- Good idea. I've hired some assassins.
- Children are portable and if you raise them to do fun things with you, they enjoy them, too.
Only after you have children do you realize how much free time you *used* to have, and how much you were blissfully able to waste it.
- I'm just finding the ability to waste time now because people *expect* me to be busy. It's great to point to the children and say "sorry, not available" and then do absolutely zip.
Could get stuck with a lousy kid
- could get a very good kid who didn't like you
- What if your kid grew up to be a reality-TV-show contestant, or to vote Conservative, or something? The horror!
- Lousy parenting is often a lot of the reason for a lousy kid.
No one can prepare you for how much your kids can push your buttons, and you *will* do at least some of those things you promised you'd never do after your parents did them to you.
- I have so far managed to avoid cleaning their faces with my spit. But it has taken herculean effort. (Derek)
- Wait until your parents age ... they'll push your buttons way more then your kids can.
We will probably disagree on parenting philosophy
- but you may see your partner in a light you never had before as a result.
- Every time they get sick, or fall, or cough, you have a little mini heart attack.
- Kids will learn this, and use it against you, setting one parent against the other -- sometimes to gain something, sometimes just for giggles.
- Is it just restricted to kids? I found that with partners, parents, coworkers.
Kids could prevent us from learning new things
- Doubtful; you'd learn in total more from having a kid
- In total, yes, but you don't necessarily get to pick the things you learn.
- Unverifiable pro-parent propaganda.
- Depends on what you want to learn. Take them along for the ride. Each one, teach one.
- You're doing something wrong if this theory proves true.
- Kids help you expand your mind. Every new thing they learn teaches you something, too. Sounds trite but it is 100% true.
We might not like being parents
- You won't have a choice in the matter.
- As a parent I would argue this is the most realistic and devastating Con on this list
- Everybody doesn't like being a parent some days. But yeah, if you really don't like it, you're screwed.
- I didn't really want kids, and my husband did. I decided to take the leap of faith because everybody always says it's the best thing they ever did. I love my child, but I don't like being a parent. I'd go back to my life before parenthood in a heartbeat.
Might eventually suffer the hassle of being a grandparent
- Being a grandparent actually isn't a hassle, it's a reward. You participate in the fun aspects of parenting with few of the responsibilities.
- Get used to providing free babysitting.
- Being a grandparent is like being a parent with out all the responsibility.
Pregnancy kind of grosses Darren out
- What can I tell you. Everywhere else in our world, from cancer to Alien, things growing inside you is bad news. (DB)
- Your opinion may change when it's your own child in there. (Derek)
- Sorry to break it to you, Darren, but it's Julie who'll be pregnant. Cut back on the Arnold films.
- My husband found pregnancy sexy. And here's a fact that isn't published very often - I had crazy, intense, multiple orgasms when I was pregnant. If pre-pregnancy orgasms were a 2 on the Richter scale, these were a 12. Seriously. It doesn't happen for everyone, but it really made up for the nausea and the swollen ankles, and my husband felt like a god for being able to produce those sensations in me.
Everyone else is doing it
- This is a really horrible, sophomoric reason to have kids.
Other parents can be boring
- Of course, so can non-parents. (DB)
- They only seem so when you're not a parent, just like geeks seem dull to non-geeks. (Derek)
We might have to look after other people's kids
- Or someone might have to look after the ones you create after collecting this list. The horror!
Might regret having kids
- Just one more regret in a line of others (why I didn't play the lottery when I had the winning numbers...)
- Did you make a similar list to determine why'd you get married?
Once you become parents, you have a whole new plane for the application of stranger judgment. (cafemama)
You might worry & stress a lot more than you do now. (denise)
- You will. On the other hand, you might also realize that many of the things you worry and stress about now don't matter one damn bit.
Worrying about them for the rest of your life is the best case scenario.
Something tragic could happen to your child (illness, pain or death) from which you and the child never recover
- Or they do recover, but the process of finding out what is going on, dealing with the medical staff, taking years to track down a diagnosis, and managing the implications for months or years makes you cynical and angry. Or is that what you meant by not recovering?
- Or the child recovers (or at least, the condition, whatever it is, becomes manageable), and going through the process makes you better able to deal with small things like colds and cuts and scrapes, and gives you a lot more patience with the irritations of dealing with insurance companies and government agencies, which drive most people absolutely up the wall.
- Or realizing that something has been wrong with your child for months or years, and you chalked it up to something else, and so their accumulated pain and health complications are a huge burden (at least until you're able to forgive yourself).
You'll lose a lot of sleep until they hit school.
Sleeping in now means 7am.
- Or 6.
- Sleep is for the weak. :)
You'll lose a lot of sleep when they are in school.
Kids usually require at least one of the parents to make some sacrifices to his or her career.
- Or if not, to pay big money for someone else to look after them while you both work somewhat as before.
- Career's are overrated anyway. Pay the bills, live for thrills.(Johnny K)
- Hear hear!
Not for the squeamish. Especially if you have any issues around bodily fluids.
- Surprisingly that stuff doesn't seem as gross to me when it's from my own kid.
- I have caught vomit in my hands (it's easier to clean hands than carpet) and I used to have a pretty weak stomach. Labor kind of cured that squeamishness for me. After that, anything that comes out of her is no great shakes. Also, when she was very small, it felt like she was still a part of me, so her fluids didn't gross me out any more than my own do. Unless you retch when you wipe your own butt, you'll probably manage to get over it.
You lose quite a bit of self-determination, in that certain hard-wired biological attributes kick in when you have kids.
- For example, before having kids you read about a parent who throws themselves into a well to rescue their kid and dies with the kid as a result, and you think "Why did they do that? What an idiot." After you have kids you think "That poor sap, they had no choice."
- You are also unable to watch stuff on TV that involves tragedy and children. Seriously, you change the channel.
Constant Whining
- From the kids or from people who don't like kids?
- Mostly the kids. You ignore those other people. (Derek)
Post Partum Depression can happen. You are already worrying about everything, and it only gets worse when the hormones take-over.
- PP _may_ happen. Then again, it may not.
- But if you don't have kids you might get hit by a car on the day that you would have been giving birth, had you decided to have kids.
- PPD is treatable. Zoloft is good, Zoloft is your pal. Just don't be too proud to accept the help that is available.
Your house will always be messy as children are perpetual-motion machines.
- But you may not care as much about messes as before.
- but once they are old enough you can teach them that cleaning is fun! (namely before they know any better, and just want to please you - oh, um that phase only lasts about three to six months - so get a good broom)
Catching and holding baby barf becomes not only commonplace, but a skill you need to develop for trips to the public pool. Professional barf catcher--and you'll be proud of it. No kidding.
Did you know they start HOMEWORK in GRADE ONE now?? I bet you didn't. SURPRISE!
- No, grade three, and the grade three stuff is very simple, just to get them into the habit. Even so, how is this a con?
- No, grade one -- half an hour a night of it, for us last year. And, haven't you played the "everybody yells until someone is crying" game over homework yet? Con in my book. (Lincoln)
- Um... If it's that much of an issue to get homework done at your house, maybe you need to change your approach? How about rewarding them for completing it, rather than punishing them (yelling) for not completing it? Also, make sure they have a break and a snack between school time and homework time...
- Depends where you are. My grade 1 daughter has some homework, but nothing too onerous. Then again, I don't consider spelling onerous. (Derek)
Homework. At least 12 years of it. Have more then one kid ... start adding the years. I'm looking at putting in another 20 years on top of what I've already done. And now Pluto has been demoted!
- Ok, to be fair this is only if you do your kid's homework. I mean come ON.
Loss of childless friends. Like it or not, once you have kids, your focus is your kids (for good reason). But, if you have friends that don't have children, they don't often relate to you child-centric lifestyle and may drift away.
- If you "lose" them then you weren't particularly good friends to begin with.(Johnny K)
- Or you aren't aware of what you sound like when you talk. (All conversations come back to 'my child this, my child that'. Quickly sends the message of where your priorities are, that theirs are not!)
- If you can't have a non-kid-centered conversation, that's your fault, not your child's! Read a newspaper occasionally for God's sake. I keep a mental list of interesting non-kid related topics of discussion, to keep my mind from turning to Jello due to constant repetitions of "where is thumbkin" and all the Boynton books. Your brain is a muscle - use it or lose it!
Other people will be judgmental about how you and your children behave in public.
- Balanced out by the fact that *you* are no longer that person. The annoyance over hysterical children becomes sympathy for their parents almost overnight . (Lincoln)
- Oh yah. The dirty looks in public places is terrific - like church - my favorite ... the place is full of grey-haireds ... um, notice people, if it weren't for people like me trying to get their children to places like this, this institution may not exist in another 20 years (you'll all be dead or drooling). Then again, this might not be a con.
You will receive unsolicited child-rearing advice from strangers, much of it misguided.
- Yeah, especially if you start another wiki called "How should we raise our kids?" or if you have any family around... (RookieMomHeather)
Taxi drivers may not drive you around, because they don't have booster seats for your kids.
- Uhm, that's why they loosened the "only taxi drivers my buy car seats" restrictions and now sell booster seats to ordinary citizens who may put them in taxies when they use them.
You'll become paranoid and conservative, working hard for laws to limit what other adults can do, out of fear that your kids might somehow see a naked breast on television or something.
- Or you'll make a conscious decision not to do this and impress your childless friends who will think raising a child is a piece of cake. Then they'll have children, become paranoid and conservative, and hate you for tricking them.
Strangers will decide it's ok to touch you when you're "preggers".
- This provides an unprecedented number of fabulous opportunities for messing with peoples' heads by simply saying, "What are you doing, I'm not pregnant!" So what if they think you're fat - the look on their face is well, well worth it (especially between 8 and 9 months...).
Sucking snot out of their noses when needed
- See previous discussion of bodily fluids. Also, this stage doesn't last forever.
If you are self-employed and choose to take mat/paternity leave, you will not receive any assistance from EI, unlike everyone else, even if you paid into the system for years before starting a business. Your business may drop off and you'll have to work hard to ramp it up again. And then you won't have as much time for networking events and the like.
I'm astounded that every PRO and CON on your list is only about you two; what about the effect that kids will have on others -- your parents, your friends?
In a more global sense, the world would be better off without yet more kids.
- In a global sense, the world would be better off without kids that consume more than they produce. If your kids affect change that improves the world, then this is a Pro.
Childbirth is painful. You might lose the distinction between your vagina and anus as you tear yourself one giant hole. Say goodbye to your body forever.
- They have drugs for the pain now. Nobody said you have to go without an epidural! (And believe me, your baby will be fine, you will bond. Heck, I gave birth by C-Section and my daughter still recognizes me!)
- Learn too late what would have helped you cope with how the last labor/birth went, and then the next one (presuming a lot here) has completely different issues, which again you may learn to handle after the fact. Learning what you'd really prefer, in advance, when you've never done it before is a huge task.
- That distinction is a myth fabricated by The Man. Maybe you'll just learn not to give in to body image stuff - especially those women's magazines that are always touting how hot it is to have a fine anus/vagina distinction.
- There are ways you can stretch that skin and care for it so that it doesn't rip.
- I had a fully natural childbirth (nary a tylenol), and it was the most awesome, inspiring, transcendant day of my life. I have never felt more strong, more powerful, more magical than I did when I gave birth. It's the closest thing I can imagine to feeling like God - feeling the miracle of creation. I would go back and do it all again in a New York minute. In fact, I'm 16 weeks along with number two, and looking forward to birth. It hurts, yes, but it's not always 36 hours of back labor. Of course, I told a friend all this, and she had 36 hours of back labor, but don't go into it expecting the worst, because you might come out of it with a 3.5 hour labor that makes you feel wonderful for days like I did.
Breastfeeding, as natural as it is, always hurts at first, and may continue to hurt to the point that you will want to scream every time you feed your baby. Cracked and bruised nipples that never seem to heal, vasospasms that make your entire torso ache every time a draft blows through the room, and babies that "clamp down" are all par for the course and make the pain of childbirth seem fleeting by comparison... but switching to a bottle seems like less and less of an option when you can see how much your baby bonds with you when you breastfeed.
- Learning how to get help, and from whom, is one of the earliest and hardest steps toward humility that many moms make. Babies seem perfect, realizing that we're not, especially when we are already bonding, can be crushing. Realizing it, and then taking steps to get help from others when the knowledge is still raw and painful can trigger feelings of inferiority that may be overwhelming.
- Breast feeding does not always hurt at first, and when it does, well it doesn't necessarily hurt any more than child birth did. Also, not breast feeding does involve some initial pain as well, as you will have engorgement as the body figures out that it doesn't need to produce milk afterall. BTW, breast feeding can help prevent the post partum depression you're concerned about. On the other hand, if you get to sucked into you must breast feed to be a good Mom and have problems and don't, then that might contribute to at least baby blues, so remember to keep perspective about the whole thing and as the other editor said - lining up help ahead of time will really take care of it.
- Breastfeeding may not hurt and it is an amazing experience. Plus, you can literally do it in your sleep if you co-sleep.
- You get a lot more rest if you co-sleep and breastfeed than if you don't co-sleep and you bottle feed. Trust me. And if it's hard to get things going, talk to the La Leche League - they're wonderful. Kellymom.com is also an excellent resource.
Even if your child is a perfect little angel, chances are he or she will have a "best friend" who is a total pain in the ass, and a bad influence on your kid, but you can't really forbid your child to see his best friend, can you?
- And no matter how much the 'best friend' irritates you and brings out the worst in your child, you'll still feel awful for them when you hear they bawled their eyes out at school when they realized that your child is going to another school this year.
- Not to mention that the parents of that little jerk has probably told him to hang out with your kid because your kid is such a good influence. The nerve!
- Or the parents of the little jerk have been having the same feelings about your 'perfect' child because your child is the bad influence, not theirs. (Never!)
Having children means having to watch or be around children's television- which is mostly sh*t.
- You get to choose wich ones, and not all of em are shit (Never seriously watched Blues's Clues?)(They tend to like the most annoying ones ie. Barney, Teletubbies)
- On the other hand, some rock - like SpongeBob. You can also introduce your child to all your favorite classics, which is fun.
- You don't have to have a TV. If you do, you don't have to let them watch it. If you do, you really shouldn't let them watch it until they're over age 2, anyway. Most of the truly awful stuff is geared toward the youngest kids (Teletubbies).
Your kids will eat your food. Get used to it.
- Off your plate. And then put some of it half-chewed back onto your plate.
- Think of the weight you'll lose by not finishing all of those too-big-anyway restaurant portions.
- Nonsense. Just start saving receipts until they're 18. Then you can say "Here, you owe me $82,000 for 453 jars of peanut butter, 1244 loaves of bread, ..."
Playing dolls is BORING and your child will want you to be a constant playmate.
- Listening to endless stories is also boring after a while, no matter how creative they are. Hooray for siblings ("Go tell your brother about that! It sounds amazing! I bet he'll love it!")
- Seems like a toss up... your partner's stories are going to be pretty freakin' boring in 20 years too.
Automatically ages you by turning you into that parent who says, "When I was a kid..."
- Sometimes several times a week. Worse when it snows.
You learn to eat healthier.
You get to experience hubris in a new way. "Whoa, we made another whole creature, and we didn't even ASK if they wanted to be made!" Who do we think we are, anyway? (could be a pro, I suppose.)
It is likely that you will make love with your spouse far less often, and almost always with the fear of being interrupted
- Quality over quantity.
You will probably have to listen to a lot of lousy music in the car for 5-10 years (re-set to zero with each new child)
- Have found the opposite to be true - my kids love blues, bluegrass, singer/songwriter/alternative, folk, world music, and classical. No Barney-sing-alongs. We never even buy the CDs.
- My son listens to what I listen to and loves it. It depends on how you raise them.
You will get to fight internal battles between your inner child and your inner parent on an ongoing basis, usually in public, and often while your child is waging the same battle externally. ("Why can't he have that?" "Do you want to give in just because he asks?" "Is it wrong to give him what he wants?" "When does it end, and how do you define the end point?" "Isn't it good for them to have a little fun, get something 'just because'?" etc.)
- This one is kind of true. It's hard to feel like you're doing the right thing.
As they grow older, you realize just how short life is and how quickly you are aging.
You will lose control of your life. (Donna B.)

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